City Islamic Society defends radical preacher and threatens the Inquirer
The City University Islamic Society has caused controversy this week after two website posts were published and quickly deleted including one that defended radical Islamist cleric Anwar al-Awlaki. A second post entitled “Words to be written in gold” strongly condemned the the Inquirer newspaper over the reporting of homophobic Islamist preacher Abu Usamah’s visit to City University in November, warning of “severe and painful punishment” for the reporters of the newspaper in the “afterlife”.
The deleted post defending al-Awlaki, which has been saved by the Inquirer and can be viewed as PDF here, was originally posted on Dec 26. The Inquirer also has the audio recording which was uploaded with the post in which Shaikh Abu Adnan who says al-Awlaki’s attackers were “liars and evil doers” and called for him to be blessed.
US-born al-Awlaki, the author of “44 ways to support Jihad”, has been linked al-Qaeda and various terrorism cases in the past including the Fort Hood shootings in Texas that killed 13 and more recently reports have emerged of ties between him and Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab the suspect in the Northwest Airlines Flight 253 terrorist attack of December 25. He was interviewed by the FBI after the 9/11 attacks, when he was accused of serving as a spiritual adviser to two of the terrorists. City Islamic Society had invited al-Awlaki to speak at an event in April 2008, where he was to address students via video link from Yemen, however university officials intervened and cancelled the event. The Islamic Society also frequently posts YouTube videos talks by al- Awlaki.
The second deleted post, published just before Christmas was a direct response to an article and editorial published in the Inquirer last November that condemned the invitation of homophobic preacher Abu Usamah. The Islamic Society post read: “We call our colleagues from the City Inquirer to a way of life for all types of people from whatever race or background they may be. A way of life based upon submitting to Allaah, Whom is One. If you do not accept this call, then we warn you of a severe painful punishment and a humiliating torment.” The Google cache reveals a heavily cut-down and edited version which says: “Whoever is not convinced by the evidence of the Qur’aan will not be convinced by anything other than the sword.” Another restored but edited version was posted after this article was written.
The reported links between al-Awlaki and the failed Christmas day bomber, University College London student Umar Abdulmutallab have once again brought into question the links between UK universities and radicalisation. The revelation that Abdulmutallab held a “War on Terror Week” of lectures when he was president of University College London’s Islamic society has increased pressure on universities to assess the threat of Islamist views on campus.
Alexander Meleagrou-Hitchens from the Centre for Social Cohesion think tank (CSC) said: “A number of Islamic societies, like that of City University and UCL, currently operate almost totally unhindered, and have free rein to invite and promote any extremist they want.”
Douglas Murray, also from the centre said: “UCL has not just failed to prevent students being radicalised, they have been complicit.”
By Fran Singh
this article is spreading so much lies and its amazing how you guys link umar farouq abdul muttalab to this just amazing, but i suppose whatever sells the story.
at present the news is nothing but made up stories which derives from the truth, however it is twisted and altered sooo much before it reaches the public, no wonder why we are so misinformed! i feel sorry for the brainwashed public, this is a form of control, and you people are mere puppets who wouldn’t like to admit it.
This is utter nonsense. How you can accuse people and take things out of context so easily is disgusting.
As far as most students are aware, the ‘City inquirer’ is a BIASED newspaper which sells stories on lies and fabricated material!
The reason it mentioned Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab is to put it IN context not take it out of context. How could we write an article, about the Isoc’s posting on al-Awlaki, who has been linked to the Dec 25 failed bombings, and not mention it?
And how you can say it is based on fabricated material, when we have links and pdf’s to the posts in full on the Isoc website?
Whatever sells a story? We aren’t selling anything. We pay for our paper and fund it ourselves. Our website is free.
al-Awlaki wrote 44 ways to support Jihad, I don’t really know how it can be argued what he says is misinterpreted. And I do think that the governments in the UK, US and Yemen consider him a threat, he has been barred from entering the UK in the past.
And it was a White House offical who made the link between the failed attacks and him.
The article taken from google cache, in its entirety is the historical saying and quote of a scholar of the 10th/11th century CE, Imam al-Ghazzaali. Thus that unpublished article says immediately beneath the quote, “Refer to Abu Haamid al-Ghazzaali wa’l-Tasawwuf”.
The quote can be found at the bottom of http://www.islamqa.com/en/ref/13473/ghazzali
However, this quote does not seem to appear anywhere on their post that they published for their readers.
…
“but i suppose whatever sells the story”
The same way the false news of al-Awlaki being killed in a raid and his house being demolished was propagated by the mainstream media. Then all of a sudden, he was resurrected back to life and every brick on his house wall rearranged themselves onto their proper places. Talk about miracles!
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/awlaki-alive/story?id=9455144
Not many of the mainstream media managed to publish this story…
…
If al-Awlaki is linked with these individuals, then why hasn’t the US done something about it?
Shouldn’t he be in their custody by now? Isn’t he the “big threat”?
Did the White House mention anything about al-Awlaki or is the media just propagating the deranged theories of alarmists?
It must be of a little bit of concern to the White House? He is after all as you say the “accused spiritual adviser” of two terrorists! Why is he walking free?
Surely, the usage of “reported”, “presumed” should give a big clue as to what news are true and what are made-up lies to simply help sell the paper or gain more post views!
Having read the PDF, many of the contents of the article posted on this website reflects its saying:
“This is just a delusion that the media managed to pull before the ignorant’s eyes by their careful choice of wordings”.
Fran, their website is a blog which means all the posts are not the view of the society so stop assuming that it is!
Secondly you disgust me how can you misquote the article. I have just read the ENTIRE article and it the nicest article I have ever read, it is only an invitation to Islam, why make it something it’s not, do u have any personal issues with the society or with Islam?
“We aren’t selling anything”
So you are doing it for the higher number of post views then?
“al-Awlaki wrote 44 ways to support Jihad”
Have you read this publication of his? What are its contents or do you just judge a book by its title and simply parrot what everyone else is writing?
“it a White House offical”
Care to state your sources? This still does not answer the question as to why Al-Awlaki is still walking free and the US are not doing anything about this “accused spiritual adviser” of terrorists!
Wow! What a beautiful and truly heartwarming article. I agree with everything. Very well written and structured. May God bless you!
Oh, Im referring to the article “Words to be written in Gold” and not this one.
This is totally a shambles. Typos, grammatical errors and tons of other mistakes. If you actually take some time to read the Islamic Societies “threat” of a “severe punishment,” instead of spending time print-screening and googling google chaches, then it is so so clear they are referring to a punishment taken up by God in the next life. How one cannot understand this goes beyond me,… and you call yourselves un-biased journalists. Lol!
What also makes me laugh is the fact that the City Inquirer have written more articles about Islam then they have anything else. Have the City Inquirer joined forces with the CSC – “hell-bent on demonising all Muslims” – as the City ISoc article reads? Hmmm… or is it because they have a sikh as their Editor. Lol, must be the latter! We all know Sikhs are staunch haters of Islam.
Anyway, I suggest maybe you read the master-piece “Words to be written in Gold” again. Maybe sit down and really give it a read. You can honestly learn alot from it. If you dont agree with it then not to worry, at least it will give you a lesson in grammer and spelling.
Oh, and one more thing. Quoting the likes of Alexander Meleagrou-Hitchens and Douglas Murray makes you lose all credibility. Have you not read what the Guardian says about them? Oh Im in such a dilemma… City Inquirer or the Guardian? There is always only one winner.
Peace!
Matthew
Grammer? HA!
Matthew. The article there now is not the one that appeared days ago, the one that appeared before, before the Google cache days ago. This version was posted approx 10 minutes after this article was written. Pre-dated and edited. Edited in quite a dramatic fashion with a lot more content about “peace” and “respect”.
I am absolutely offended about the anti-Sikh comments you have written here. Please take your small minded, obviously sheep-like views away
What…the guardian which pretty much reiterates everything written in this article? Written after the Inquirer wrote it?
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jan/03/terrorism-uksecurity
Your beloved Guardian who cite Al-Awlaki is banned from the UK? The fact the US and UK aren’t doing anything about it possibly something do to the fact he is living in Yemen? And banned from the UK?
@ Alison Severs
LOL. Now that is funny! My bad… Typo
But Im not the one writing the artice! Comments are meant to have typos. Looks like Miss Fran has editted the article. She must have read City ISoc’s one.
LOL
Peace!
Zooming off to my dictionary.
Matthew,
The “master-piece [sic] Words to be written in Gold” is nothing but a redundant, childish, small minded fantasy. Much like your grasp of the English language.
I would advise you to properly spellcheck your posts if you wish to nitpick over spelling and grammar, as you will find “grammar” does not contain an e. The word “masterpiece” is not hyphenated.
Do you know that Fran Singh is a Sikh? And also that all Sikhs hate Islam? Or are you guilty of exactly the type of stereotyping, false assumptions and poor English you claim to find in this article?
“MEGA LOLS” MATTHEW!
Don’t put “@” you avid forum trawling social networking shit head.
@ Nova
How does the guardian reitirate everything written in this article? Does it shed light upon the so called “threat” of the ISoc?
As far as I know, all ISocs condemn terrorism, extremism and the killing of innocent people under the name of Islam. Umar Abdulmutallab began holding his views on Jihad after he graduated from UCL and was not in any way shape or form influenced in UCL or by their ISoc. Read the link to the guardian you posted. It says,
“It is becoming clear that he had very close contacts across Europe and Africa, some of whom had extreme views,” said a senior Whitehall source. “There is no evidence of criminal activity, but there is evidence that he held extreme views and was in contact with those who had such views as long ago as 2007.”
And again,
Qasim Rafiq, who was also involved in UCL’s Islamic Society, said he had shown no signs of violent extremism, but had cut himself off from friends a month after leaving university. “When I heard the news I wasn’t sure what to think. I thought: could this really be the same person?” he told the BBC.
So it seems from this article that Umar began holding his extremist views after graduating from UCL.
Peace!
Matthew
@ Micheal
Opsy Daisy, I spelt your name wrong. Oh my!
Fran Singh is a sick Sikh and it is part of the Sikh belief to hate Muslims. Give their religion a read. May find something interesting.
@ Alison Severs
Wow, someones getting rowdy. Take a chill pill love. Cant take it now?
If the iSoc was not ashamed or embarrassed about their two articles, why were they quickly removed?
Are extremists factions within the iSoc being reigned in and censored to avoid bad publicity?
1. The City Islamic Society has a record of inviting the most extreme and most cretinous Islamist preachers to address its meetings. Some of them are slavering enthusiasts for al-Qaida.
2. These meetings are always set up not as debates but as diatribes by the nutcase preachers the ISoc invites.
3. The meetings are always segregated between men and women.
4. The ISoc needs not tolerance but serious therapy.
@ Micheal
I swear the “words to be written in gold” article can still be found on their website?
http://cityisoc.com/
Yup, still there.
Extremist factions within the ISoc? You are right there, the ISoc are extremists! I find them extremely kind, extremely helpful, extremely caring, extremely generous, extremely loving. If it wasnt for the ISoc I wouldnt have embraced islam. Maybe thats why everyone seems to be against them. They cant stand them growing in numbers, changing minds and having a postive influence of people like me.
Peace!
Matthew.
I haven’t actually edited a word of this article since I wrote it. Maybe one of our sub-editors has spotted errors and edited without my knowledge. I do apologise my apparent bad “grammer” has offended you.
For the record I am an atheist and third generation. Keep your views on Sikhism to yourself or get off my website.
I am writing an article about City Islamic Society and a few individuals…not Islam and all Muslims.
Since the invitation was extended to Abu Usamah we have had contact from several Muslim students at the university disagreeing with the Isoc so please don’t brand us with the terribly lazy “islamaphobic” tag. It is so easy to hide behind.
Also, at least I am brave enough to put my name and face to my views. Whereas you hide behind anonymous names and made-up email addresses.
Extremely kind people don’t warn of “severe punishment and humiliating torment” and threaten “to be convinced by the sword” anyone that doesn’t sign up to their miserable religious fantasy.
Extremely loving people don’t call you “sick” for being a Sikh (or having a Sikh surname).
Abu Usamah says homosexuals should be nailed to a cross and bleed to death over 3 days. That doesn’t sound very kind to me. Or tolerant. Neither does being called “filthy” for being Christian and Jewish or “mentally deficient” for being a woman.
100 per cent solidarity Fran. Keep it coming!
@ Fran
You edited this article? Hmmm, so I guess this is the edited version of the original article that was written. I’ve heard that somewhere before, “edited version” where was it again…?
Atheist eh? Just as bad. Worse actually. Still gonna burn in hell. Ill be one of the guys mocking you as ure punished. Youll see me waving on my throne. Youll know its me. Have you thought about it? Everlasting punishment in hellfire? Forever and ever and ever. Drinking pus and eating thorns? Burning for eternity with ure fellow Inquirer journalists! “A severe and painful punishment.” You do deserve it though. Totally!
Are you sure Muslims complained about Abu Usamah or were they just “Muslims.” Look, a Muslim is defined as someone who submits to God and His Messenger, and part of submission is to show and have allegiance towards the Muslims and enmity towards the disbelievers (kuffar – non derogatory, I know and you dont so leave it). No Muslim can be a Muslim if he complains to the disbelievers about a Muslim. Make sense? Good. So the people that complained to you were in fact non Muslims. Comprende? Now thats clear.
Brave enough to add my email address? Are you like… CRAZY!? I dont want City Inquirer spams every two seconds. And why on earth do you wanna have my email address? Im sorry, but I dont give my email address to think-I-know-it-all third generation atheists. If you were fourth then maybe. But not third.
Day of Judgement my dear, we will see who has the last laugh. No, it will happen before that. You wait for the angel of death. I swear by God you wait. You will be paid ur wages in full. You wait.
Peace
Matthew
“@matthew” You can tell if someone was 30 in the 90’s “take a chill pill” how about shit off you ignorant bastard. When was the last time you read a newspaper? Rather than chasing internet threads under the most obvious pseudonym I think I’ve ever seen.
Hey Matthew my email is alison@viceuk.com, Fran’s is fran@fransingh.com – do you worst but you are actually clinically insane…
Matthew,
You don’t give your email because you are a coward.
You hide behind Allah because you are a coward.
You fantasise about hell punishments for your intellectual superiors because you are a coward.
Cowardly stumbling through life, clinging onto pathetic little fantasies, invoking the word of god to save you from your spelling mistakes. I pity you, not in the next life, in this one right here.
@ Micheal
Scenario: You are living in a house were the kitchen is on fire and a lion is loose. Guests come in and they wanna warm some food up in the kitchen. You say “dont go in the kitchen, youll burn and be eaten up by a lion.” They think ur an extremist and are being rude. But in reality, they do not kw that if they were to go to the kitchen theyll burn and face some serious trouble with the lion because there is in fact a fire in the kitchen and a lion on the loose. Similarly, due to the understanding of the Muslims and them knowing for sure the reason and purpose to life, and paradise and hellfire being a reality, they are telling you without any doubt that if you die as a non Muslim, ure going to burn in the hellfire forever. A severe torment and a painful punishment. If they didnt care theyll be like the jews and not tell you. Hence they are extremely thoughtful!
Every non Muslim is sick. No person can claim to be sick free until he has seen and grasped the truth, which is the religion of Islam.
Homos, Christians, Jews and Muslims all detest the act of homosexuality. Have you read the story of Lot? Well its in the Bible, the Old Testament and the Quran. Homosexuality is a diesease and is going against the laws of God. Who knows better? You or God?
Women being deficient is something the ISoc will need to address. And boy they have a perfect explanation. Why dont u ever pop down and ask them? Every tuesdays from 12 to 2.
Oh and homosexuals being nailed down and and bleeding to death for three days? Who on earth said that!? As far as I kw Islam says stone them to death or throw them off a mountain. Bleeding to death? Is this Quilliam speaking again?
Peace
OK, so at the end of all this we know that the City ISoc still has its quotient of crazed homophobic misogynist Al-Qaida wannabe pants bombers. Right or wrong?
@ Paul Anderson
1. Extreme according to who? One mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist. Who decides who is extremist and who isnt? I think you should kw Islam has its own definition of extremism and it has two forms. Extremely moderate and extremely extreme. Islam always takes the middle route. The speakers that are invited are from the middle route.
2. Wheres freedom of speech now?
3. So what if the ISoc talks are segregated? Your toilets are.Your football matches are. Your cricket matches are. Our women feel discrimnated if they are put into the same room as men. Thats because they have something called shame. Do you kw what that is? Its something your women do not have. They walk around half naked for all to see. Women are used in the western world. Used as sex objects for men. Now you tell me. Whats better?
4. You are right. Our therapy is the Quran. Our heart is the words of God. No external therapy other than the words of God and His Messenger is needed. We are a proud people upon the religion of truth. You just cant stand it that the fastest growing religion in the world is Islam. I tell you what my friend, in 20 years time your daughter and your son will come home one day telling you they are Muslims. What you gonna do? Have you thought about it yet? You deny it now but your heart knows it. You cannot stop Islam. No one can!
Just to let you kw Im off to pray now so wont reply. Ill check my computer after prayer. No, Im gonna sleep after prayer. So tomorrow God willing.
1. One man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter. What an old cliche and irrelevant here, because we’re talking about Islamist totalitarians who would like to destroy every freedom we have. “Freedom fighters”, my arse.
2. Er, I’m all in favour of freedom of speech. I just don’t like Mosleyite rallies.
3. So desegregate toilets and football matches and join me in celebratory unisex nudism on a beach near you with Sikhs and Hindus and atheists — the Christians won’t join in because they’re so square. Women are good fun and their bodily functions are not disgusting. I dream of a world in which we can all frolic freely, naked in the sun.
4. You read your book and I’ll read mine, matey. Actually, I have more than one.
HaHaHa! Did someone just call Fran a Sikh?! Very presumptuous and not really the best way of demonstrating you can make a valid and well balanced, factually founded argument really is it?!
AS FOR:
‘Do you know that Fran Singh is a Sikh? And also that all Sikhs hate Islam? Or are you guilty of exactly the type of stereotyping, false assumptions and poor English you claim to find in this article?’
DID YOU KNOW THAT A BUMBLE BEE DIES WHEN IT STINGS? Completely irrelevant fact, just like the one you try to make. It’s also inaccurate, just like the claim you tried to make.
We don’t have freedom of speech OR of expression, just as we don’t have an absolute right to privacy in the UK. We don’t have a bill of rights or a chartered constitution (yet), just a sloppy debate between our countries sovereignty and EHR.
‘Do you kw what that is? Its something your women do not have. They walk around half naked for all to see. Women are used in the western world. Used as sex objects for men. Now you tell me. Whats better?’
….That is FOUL. You’re just showing your narrow-mindedness. Do you know why Islam is feared? Because pathetic comments like this are made:
‘ You cannot stop Islam. No one can!’………………………… Recognize it? A little ‘extreme’ wouldn’t you say?
HA! I have just noticed, all the comments, bar the ones agreeing with the Inquirer are from the same IP addess.
“Matthew” and “…” are the same. University student and “reported” not “proven” are also the same people.
ALSO! RATHER UNSHOCKINGLY! responsible for a lot of the comments on this website.
Before you ask, have also check the IP address and it does not belong to a communal computer, in uni etc.
Oh, and also, another suprise. You (Matthew) have the same IP address as those who have been posting the “official views of the City Islamic Society” on the website in previous articles.
Matthew are you a member of the Isoc?
Matthew why in previous quotes do you refer to yourself as Abdullah not Matthew?
Nova…
Saddam Hussain was living in Iraq, in his fortress, surrounded by his troopers. The UK and US managed to do something about that “threat”.
Al-Awlaki as the hatemongers say is “accused”, a “spiritual adviser”, and is alive and running… and everyone knows his location… why not do the same? Get him if he is really a “threat” and not someone who will just make the news!
Fran…
You still have not cited your source about the White House official accusing al-Awlaki being linked with any of these individuals.
For everyone else…
City Inquirer is not really a credible source, rather a collection of different bits of jargon from different newspapers compiled into one article. Real journalism.
I just read your comment above:
“University student and “reported” not “proven” are also the same people.”
Any proof for this or are you just making it up again? Couldn’t answer my questions, so you resort to lies?
Matthew, your scenario with the burning kitchen and lion is quite an interesting one but you forget a quite important detail – I’m not your guest and I’m not trying to warm any of my food in your kitchen and niether is anyone else here. So I’m quite safe from both fire and lion. Thanks for the warning, but it really doesn’t apply.
The fact that you preach tolerance but positively relish the chance to laugh at my horrible punishment from your rather gay-sounding throne speaks for itself and doesn’t need any further embelishment. Similary your idea of a God (or indeed a person) who would submit any of his/her children to such punishment just because they didn’t do exactly as they were told is unthinkable to most people here – especially when said God/person is supposed to be the embodiment of love.
Your thoughts are welcome here – I have many Muslim (or, erm, non-muslim as you would doubtless call them) friends who are all lovely, and sometimes it’s easy to forget that mindless zealots like you still exist.
Peace to you brother, and you really should keep an eye on that burning kitchen of yours – if you’re not careful the whole house will go up and then what will you have?
So Matthew is the “official” of the City Islamic Society! Don’t understand how the internet works huh? At least not as much as a “deficient” woman does! That must really sting your misogynist little hearts.
Its so funny that you have completely rewritten the article on the cityisoc.com website to make it less extreme, then pretend it was like that all along! Such liars. And cowards.
Interesting to see that there is no response from Matthew. What a coward.
Fran, it REALLY doesn’t suprise me! The University needs to get its priorities in order. The Student Unions focus has always been to try and accomodate it’s foreign students and give religions their fair represention throughout the University, however this is often at the cost of any kind of Student Welfare. The Islam Soc (or however it’s referred to) has always been allowed to run riot and has always brought the Universities reputation into call. Maybe Uni should ban the societies and focus on looking after its students… just an idea!
People these days are too quick to try and disagreements and opinions into racist conflictions, when it’s often not the case. I was also disgusted in how the Student Union handled the student fetalities a month of so ago by demanding meetings to sort our ‘racial problems’ and spread awareness of Islamaphobia.
Most people are not Racist.
Most people are not Islamaphobic.
… Though when you get threads like this and hear how narrow-minded people can be, the existance of Islamaphobia doesn’t come as a shock, surely it’s to be expected? Just something to think about because it is the way you make YOUR points ‘Micheal’, that puts fear into people.
@ Matthew
Before you open your mouth and publicly vilify someone, do you actually engage your brain at all? Firstly, I don’t think this is really the forum for such an attack and secondly, do you really need to make it so abusive and personal? The main reason for your belligerence here all boils down to a question of faith, which we can all safely say, there is a lot of disagreement on around the World. In this case though, there is none, the piece is merely a news story about the facts at hand, not a point of view from Fran Singh. The article itself offers no opinion about Abu Usamah’s faith.
I think that everyone is entitled to their own point of view (however misguided it may be). When prejudice is acted upon we get truly terrible situations, The Holocaust, Apartheid, ‘9/11′, to name just a few, which I personally would have preferred not to have happened. But this is obviously, just my opinion.
The article appears to me to be unbiased., presenting nothing but the facts of the situation. I may be wrong. But judging its merit on any spelling or grammatical errors is just childish and quite simply unnecessary.
Automatically assuming its author is of any particular religious persuasion based on her name might be automatic to you but did you know there are people in this world who choose to form their own opinion on religion rather than mechanically adopting the one they were born into. Maybe you should have asked her before impulsively making a bit of a tit of yourself. Yes, her name may be of Sikh origin but in modern society, that doesn’t mean she is one. The fact that she is an atheist means that she has already made a decision that there is NO afterlife, ergo your comment that she is “gonna burn in hell” isn’t really going to have any effect on her is it? All it shows is that you are a dick of epic proportions. My rancor here is nothing to do with religion, I’m just witness to a verbal attack on an innocent person. I don’t care if you’re Muslim, Catholic, Jewish or Jedi, you’re still a twat.
If you really want to have your say, a comment thread really isn’t the place to make yourself heard. Go out there and do something about it. Why not start your own paper/ website? Maybe you already have one. Just don’t expect me to read it.
Michael
*Matthew not Michael..
I’ve been thinking about the lion and the burning kitchen. Like Nick, I’m not Matthew’s guest, and I’ve no intention of warming up any food – so it’s not *really* my problem. But my neighbourly advice to Matthew would be to call the fire brigade at once and contact the local zoo. The firemen might well be atheists who rarely wash and the zoo-keepers are almost certainly Zionist lesbians, but if they put out the fire and recapture the lion they’ll have done you a couple of very big favours.
@ Matthew
Before you open your mouth and publicly vilify someone, do you actually engage your brain at all? Firstly, I don’t think this is really the forum for such an attack and secondly, do you really need to make it so abusive and personal? The main reason for your belligerence here all boils down to a question of faith, which we can all safely say, there is a lot of disagreement on around the World. In this case though, there is none, the piece is merely a news story about the facts at hand, not a point of view from Fran Singh. The article itself offers no opinion about Abu Usamah’s faith.
I think that everyone is entitled to their own point of view (however misguided it may be). When prejudice is acted upon we get truly terrible situations, The Holocaust, Apartheid, ‘9/11′, to name just a few, which I personally would have preferred not to have happened. But this is obviously, just my opinion.
The article appears to me to be unbiased., presenting nothing but the facts of the situation. I may be wrong. But judging its merit on any spelling or grammatical errors is just childish and quite simply unnecessary.
Automatically assuming its author is of any particular religious persuasion based on her name might be automatic to you but did you know there are people in this world who choose to form their own opinion on religion rather than mechanically adopting the one they were born into. Maybe you should have asked her before impulsively making a bit of a tit of yourself. Yes, her name may be of Sikh origin but in modern society, that doesn’t mean she is one. The fact that she is an atheist means that she has already made a decision that there is NO afterlife, ergo your comment that she is “gonna burn in hell” isn’t really going to have any effect on her is it? All it shows is that you are a horrible person. My rancour here is nothing to do with religion, I’m just witness to a verbal attack on an innocent person. I don’t care if you’re Muslim, Catholic, Jewish or Jedi, you’re still a twat.
If you really want to have your say, a comment thread really isn’t the place to make yourself heard. Go out there and do something about it. Why not start your own paper/ website? Maybe you already have one. Just don’t expect me to read it.
Michael C
@ Fran
LOOOL, u think ur some kinda Sherlock Holmes or something? Wait, ur not! Ur detective findings are all fabricated! Lies upon lies just like ur article. I, Matthew am not “…” or “University student” or even ‘“reported” not “proven”’. I do not have any of their same IP addresses. I cant believe ull just lie like that. I swear by God that you have lied. I swear again and again! I do not have the same IP address as any of them and I challenge you to print screen your findings and show us all. Because you cannot and u kw u cannot. And u kw why? Because ur a liar. What a stunt! God I cant stop laughing. We should call u the joker from now on. The clown of all clowns. Oh my, I love ur comedy. Im coming here everyday just for ur jokes. Love it!City Inquirer are the biggest clowns ever!!! Prove me wrong if u can, show us all that we have the same IP addresses. Go on then. Print screen it, or Ill have to resort in putting a red nose on ur facebook picture. HA!
Every Muslim is an Abdullah “slave of Allah”. So yes, sometimes I post as Abdullah and sometimes I post as Matthew. But me being “…” “University Student” and “reported not proven” is one of the greatest jokes Ive ever read. Thats it, uve even lost the little credibility u had. LOL
And yes I am an ISoc member like every Muslim at City is. Not a very high one at the mo but hopefully oneday.
@ Nick
Can I ask you “brother,” what is the Christians belief regarding Muslims who do not accept Jesus as the son of God or recognise the Holy Father, the Holy son and the Holy Spirit? (How can u get a holy spirit btw? I thought ghosts were scary!) Do Christians not believe in a hell fire? Is it not true that those who reject the trinity and Jesus being the son of God will be thrown in the fire? But Im confused, how can this be if “your idea of a God (or indeed a person) who would submit any of his/her children to such punishment just because they didn’t do exactly as they were told is unthinkable to most people here – especially when said God/person is supposed to be the embodiment of love.”
We Muslims believe that God is ever loving, ever merciful, oft forgiving, but He is also just, severe in punishment, the avenger and the greatest of all. So yes, God loves those who follow His way (i.e. Muslims) and hates those who go against His way (i.e. non Muslims) and has prepared for both something they deserve in the next life.
@ Micheal
I am an ISoc member like every Muslim at City is. Not a very high one at the mo but hopefully oneday. “Official” spokesman? No not yet. But hopefully one day God willing.
Do you have any proof the ISoc article has been rewritten? Maybe it was edited or revised like how the above was? Where has all the typos and “grammer” mistakes dissapeared to? Surely someone must have edited it. Or maybe, was it the Holy Spirit? Ooooo. Spooky!
@ Amy
Muslims dont spend their entire lives stuck behind a computer replying to hillarious posts by clowns who fabricate evidence pretending to be detectives. We have lives and a purpose in life. We kw exactly where we r going, what we need to get to where we r going, and why we r going there in the first place. Our lives have a meaning, a reason and a purpose. Unlike yours, living a life for what? Have u ever contemplated as to what will happen after u die? When u r carried to ur grave and r placed inside. What is going to happen then? Think. Life has more meaning then fun, laughter and play.
@ Rachel
Not even worth commenting. Have a good day
@ Paul Anderson
Still thinking about the lion in the kitchen? LOL. Let me guess, our pathetic nudist is now fantasizing about lions. Oh my God! You people are disgusting. Utterly and totally disgusting!
Matthew is this a joke? Are you a recruitment officer for the BNP or something?
Matthew, I have now retired to bed with the lion and a dozen Sikh lesbian nudists — and as I write this they are fondling the lion’s testicles while munching bacon sarnies, quaffing champagne and spliffing up. The lion, needless to say, has got the horn, and is causing all sorts of problems. But the fire in the kitchen has been extinguished, and I’m just about to go out to get some ciggies from Ali, the Kurdish Muslim who runs my local off-licence. What a swell party this is!
Fran, you poor delusional woman.
I challenge you to prove that I am the other guys like you claim I am…FYI I am a FEMALE student from another university, so please do print the so-called same IP addresses as Matthew has also challenged you to.
And some sort of journalist you are, “accused”not”proven” has asked you to provide evidence on a few things, which you cannot, so clearly you are BIASED by only providing ‘evidence’ for a few of your statements and not others, you can’t pick and choose darling!!
Leave Fran alone you coward.
Have you seen the iSoc website? Who designed that for you? 1998?
Compare your trashy gambling/spam site with the clean elegant design you see here. You do realise the 90s was the decade before last? I guess its more up to date than your attitude towards women and homosexuality.
Paul, I nearly died laughing at about three of your posts today… you’re on good form.
Nearly died laughing at most of Matthew’s posts too, but not for the same reason. Life may have more meaning “then [sic] fun, laughter and play” but it’s a bloody good place to start.
I am sorry for not replying to you all sooner. I have been busy taking screen grabs. And pouring over my answers to you redundant questions. Oh no, that’s right, I haven’t, I have been out.
“LOOOL, u think ur some kinda Sherlock Holmes or something? Wait, ur not! Ur detective findings are all fabricated! Lies upon lies just like ur article. I, Matthew am not “…” or “University student” or even ‘“reported” not “proven”’.
I’m not entirely sure what is so funny to laugh out out out loud about? Matthew/Abdullah/Slave of Allah whatever you are calling yourself. I didn’t say you were “reported’ not “proven” or University student. There was a full stop in the middle of what I wrote. So no, I can’t prove you are someone who I never claimed you were in the first place. However by your own admission you have been going under three different names on this website in the past which was the point I was trying to make.
“University Student” and “reported not proven”. I am not going to trawl through the 50 comments and bother looking back for the IP addresses of ANONYMOUS PEOPLE yet again. It is time consuming and be you the same person, or separate people,it’s a bit redundant considering you are anonymous anyway. With pretty much the same points.
What the heck is going on out here? I don’t deny the charm of a dozen sikh lesbian nudists (can I use that, what a great visual image, especially if they are delicately fondling lion testes, brilliant) but as the conversation continues, Matthew is becoming more extreme as he(?) is feeling cornered.
Matthew, I know you are defending important values. Please don’t allow that to move you in that direction. You don’t deserve to be ganged up on. I have no idea why you feel that you need to feel that you are part of a group that is powerful at the expense of the power of others. It does not have to be this way. I don’t think you are insane at all, but I hope that you seek out people that you can trust, that have moderate islamic views or even just someone you think is a good listener. I am saying this in all sincerity, there is no derision in this last paragraph and I hope that you don’t think there is.
Do the people commenting ever wonder what it is that makes some people feel so isolated, attacked, and alone that they become vulnerable to extremist recruitment strategies?
Er, he started it.
Clearly no good is coming from this, my time is more precious to worship my Lord, than to sit here arguing with the misguided.
May Allaah guide you all, and save my brothers n I from the Hell fire, Ameen.
Dylan I do agree that this is getting too personal and heated. Yes Paul, he did bring out the Sikh thing and make it personal attack but I do think this is going too far. Some of the things Matthew has been saying are pretty offensive and worrying but there are also comments antagonising the situation from the other side.
As I have said before, this is reporting the Islamic Society and a few individuals, not all Muslims or making assumptions about Islam. I would appreciate if everybody, on both sides of the argument, could avoid the sweeping generalisations and name calling
That’s really put the dampeners on what was looking to be an excellent all-night party. The randy lion and the Sikh lesbians have all quit my bedroom and gone down the pub. I’m left alone again with no one to talk to and nothing but my memories.
Matthew,
In response to your questions about Christian beliefs and hellfire, my answer would be… well, I wouldn’t really know because I’m not a Christian! Have you done that little thing you do of assuming someone’s religion based on their name again Matthew?
Hi everyone,
I’ve been following the discussion (if I can call it that) and I have to say that it is unfortunate. This short post is my little attempt to bring back a little sanity.
First of all, I am a Muslim…. the name (my real name) is a giveaway. I’m not at City University but was once part of an ISoc before graduating.
The article above may be offensive to Muslims in that it seems to present a dailymail style expose of City ISoc using a post on their blog or a comment rather than an outright statement. It also takes for granted that individuals are guilty simply because other media reports say they are when no hard evidence has been brought forward to the contrary. By stating things in the way they have said, the author manages to bring up various different elements including recent political events, Islamic opinions on sexuality and the ISocs general behaviour and attitude. Conflating these varying issues together manages only to produce a confused article – and draw a confused and bitter response.
However, the responses I have seen here by some of the Muslims needs to be dealt with as well. Brothers and sisters, we are capable of dealing with the above in a calm and reasoned manner. We do not need to resort to chest beating, self flagellating or name-calling. No matter how badly we feel we’ve been treated, we’ve been ordered (ordered, not recommended) to call to the way of Allah with wisdom and patience. Both are in short supply in your posts. And this attitude of staring down our noses at non-Muslims is hardly going to win you any friends is it? Whilst I hold many of the same sentiments with regards to alcohol, free-mixing, hedonism etc… as you may do – to condescendingly sneer at individuals for their “disgusting” lives only serves to paint yourself as an elitist set apart from the rest of society… someone from a saved sect whom all others are unworthy of his time. Rather we should say as the Prophet (peace be upon him) said when questioned why he stood in respect for the passing funeral bier of a Jew, “is he not a human being?”
Before you start labelling me a liberal Muslim desperate to get some appreciation from the establishment… i’m not. I’m far more conservative in my views than anyone at your university is – however, the difference is that when I think that when an article (or more than one article) paints Muslims in a negative light then I will respond to it appropriately and in a way that will hopefully generate a discussion rather than confrontation. It is easy to do what you guys are doing – condemn, hurl an insult and walk away from the rest of the world who are destined to burn in hell anyway. It is much harder to make a case respectfully, to point out faults forcefully but politely and to realise (slightly more cynically) that you and the author are locked in a struggle for the hearts and minds of the Muslims and non-Muslims on campus – one making an assertion and the other a counter-assertion.
Despite this, we should not compromise on our morals, our character OR our doctrinal views… or our ability to see the other person as a human being too.
So lets stop the dissing and the cussing and get back to discussing. Ok?
This is going to be my last post because I got a rolocking from the ISoc President and Exct Committee for posting here in the first place. So:-
@ Fran
How did the fullstop appear? Did you revise and edit the comment again like you did with one of your other comments (and the article of course)? Or have they been edited by the sub-editors? Interesting. Nevertheless, you said ‘“Matthew” and “…” are the same.’ This is the second time I ask you. Can you please prove this? You also said ‘University student and “reported” not “proven” are also the same people.’ Proof? Because I assure you and everyone reading these comments that you are lying.
@ Dylan C
I sincerely thank you and wish you all the very best with everything in your life. No pun or sarcasm intended. I promise. Your comment has been the most genuine of all the others and it seems extremely sincere. I would like to make a few comments if possible though. I will try my utmost to treat you with respect because this is only the right you deserve after the way you treated me. May God make you of the people He loves amen.
1) Moderate Islamic views. What does this mean? I posted a comment in reply to someone before concerning how Islam strictly condemns extremism and extremism in moderation. But I must ask, how do we define ‘moderate?’ If moderate is defined as someone whom compromises his very core beliefs and principles to ‘blend in’ or due to the ‘time and environment’ they live in then Islam strictly condemns such form of moderation. This is because Islam is a religion for all times, all environments and all people and has core principles and beliefs that can never ever be compromised. This is the religion of God, who are we to pick and choose what we like and what we dont? These beliefs include our views on monotheism, polytheism, prayer, fast, compulsory charity, innovation in religion, jihad, shariah law, death and capital punishments, homosexuality, the role, rights and responsibilities of men and women, the veil, non Muslims, paradise and hellfire and so on and so forth. Our views on such topics can never ever be compromised or altered because God has not allowed us room for manoeuvre in such topics. Hence, if moderation is defined as someone whom compromises his faith Islam is strictly and totally against it.
However if we define moderation as taking the middle route, one which is in-between extremism and extremism in moderation then this is exactly what Islam teaches. This is called the wasitiyyah ‘the middle route.’ Islam prohibits swaying from this route, whether it be towards the path of extremism or the path of extremism in moderation. This is the correct path and one which all Muslims are obliged to accept and implement. This path entails one to worship God upon the methodology He loves and has decreed. Examples of the views of the middle route are as follows:-
- A person can only attain true inner and outer peace by accepting Islam as their religion
- A person can only save himself from the fire of hell by becoming a Muslim
- A person must understand that Gods rules are final
- A person must understand that the Prophets rules are the same as Gods because it has come from God
- A person can only worship God by following the way of His final Prophet
- A person must not compromise or bend his views on matters that are firm and have no space for manoeuvre
Using the above we then have the following views:-
- The Muslim believes that homosexuality is a disease and a crime against God and that the homosexual who commits homosexuality will be punished by God in the next life. This is because this is what God says in the Quran and what the Prophet says in the sunnah. If the homosexual commits homosexuality in the land of the Muslims which is ruled by the shariah law then he and his partner (if his partner contested) should face the death punishment to be enforced by the state and not by any random individual. If however the homosexual commits homosexuality in lands other than Islam or the shariah law then he is to be treated with respect and called to Islam like everyone else. No Muslim is allowed to take the matter in his own hands. Note:- Having homosexual urges or inclinations are not punished until one acts upon them.
- Then we have our views on women, jihad etc.
This is what Islam says about moderation. It entirely depends upon your definition.
Anyway ppl, been nice talking to you. If u have any serious q’s about Islam or our views why not come to the prayer room and ask for the president or headsis. Theyll explain it much much much better then me. It shows more sincerity then discussing it over here.
Oh, and Fran, the ISoc are grateful for your work. They really are! The ISoc thrives on controversy, your attacks have only contributed in calling more people to Islam. What happened after America accused the Muslims of plotting 9/11? Islam became the fastest growing religion in America. What happened after Britain accused Muslims of plotting 7/7? Islam continued to grow beyond imagination. What happened after City Inquirer attacked the ISoc for their pure and correct Islamic beliefs? The ISoc not only grew and strengthened beyond imagination, but it is the fastest growing and largest Society in university. Ever wondered why??? Because of ppl like u.
All praise and thanks are to Allah!
I end with:-
“Cooperation in seeking truth is inherent to religion, but sincerity in the pursuit of truth can be distinguished by certain conditions and signs. A diligent seeker of truth may be compared to one who is looking for his lost camel. It would be immaterial for him if he or another person should be the one to find it. Likewise, a sincere truth-seeker would perceive his partner as a helper rather than an adversary, and would be grateful to him if he should guide him to truth.” – Al-Ghazali
The ISoc are your helpers, be grateful that they are calling you to Paradise.
Peace out!
Matthew/Abdullah/Slave of Allah
I am just going to address a few points here. I know not answering every single little question will see me labelled as incapable of answering rather than unwilling to but I don’t have time to spend 4 days responding to questions from a 400 word article. I would be here forever.
I stand by the article entirely.
Matthew, if you wish to contact me with your real name and email address I would be happy to talk to you but I am not publishing IP addresses publicly as it is unprofessional and irresponsible. I have screen shots. Also of the revisions made to website and comments since publishing (which for the record are none, the article was published and has not been touched since, nor have any of the comments, including mine or yours, no full stops added, nothing).
The link between Anwar al-Awlaki (and the Isoc’s comments on him) and Abdulmutallab is clearly sourced and well documented. Here is the quote from the White House official, John Brennan, the US deputy national security adviser for homeland security and counter-terrorism
“There are indications that he had contact, direct contact with Abdulmutallab”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/8438635.stm
I have based my views on what I have read as direct quotes from officials in newspapers and other news outlets, just like everybody else has but also, with new and primary source information relating to the Isoc. The Isoc website, is the website of the Isoc, not a blog or forum, that anyone can write on. It is controlled by the Isoc who make clear decisions on what they post. If the Isoc don’t stand by their statements made to the Inquirer and defending al-Awlaki, then they should not publish them or think before publishing them and deleting.
In defense of the journalism here, news has to work on reporting new information in the context of what has already been said and you will note many respected news organisations including the BBC and both left and right wing national newspapers have noted the links between London universities, previous invitations to Abu Usamah from UCL and also City’s previous invitation to al-Awlaki.
In the Observer on 3rd Janaury 2010, you will see they also make the link between City and Anwar al-Awlaki in an article about Abdulmutallab. The Telegraph even goes on to mention City, and also list terrorists who have graduated from London universities http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/yemen/6906669/Detroit-bomber-British-university-complicit-in-radicalisation.html
However these publications are not being called delusional, islamaphobic, liars and bad journalists.
To those who think I have misconstrued what the Islamic Society originally posted about the Inquirer. The words can be seen by everyone. I do perceive this threatening language. You may disagree, perhaps I am just old fashioned and don’t use the words “painful and severe punishment” and “humiliating torment” in day to day dialogue. In the same breath as wishing peace and respect upon a person. I would certainly not tell anyone they should be punished for their beliefs. I am not the one who has got personal and offensive.
Again, this article is about a handful of extremists, and the Islamic Society. Not Islam.
Matthew, it seems to me you thrive on controversy and I am happy the Islamic society has been so keen to distance itself from the views you have posted on this page.
http://cityisoc.com/4060-gheebah-buhtaan-nameemah/
@ Fran
I kw I said I wouldnt post another comment but u leave me no option but to go back on my word. Im sorry but I just cant help it. U said n I quote [in reference to your article which u still "stand by"]:-
‘the article was published and has not been touched since’
Are u sure Fran? Really sure? U promise the article has never been edited after being published? U kw what? I dont believe a word u say and I honestly cannot stand liars. Especially those who lie right at u. Let me prove this.
Do u visit fortune tellers by any chance? Maybe u can see the future or something because there is no way u could have written this article except that it has been edited after it was published. Do u kw why I say this? I quote from ur article ur statement regarding the article written by the ISoc:-
“Another restored but edited version was posted AFTER THIS article was written”
The ISoc had taken down their statement and were revising and editting it after being asked by the SU to do so. They only restored the article after this article was written so that everyone can see the entire context of what they wrote and understand that the “threat” is one that is to be carried out in the next life. Now you tell me. If this article was not editted after it was published, how on earth did u kw the ISoc would restore and edit their statement after this article was written?! How? Maybe u can predict the future. Maybe u visit fortune tellers. Maybe u saw the ISoc restoring their statement in your dream. It is clear that unless u posess some wonderful gift of predicting the future, you or one of your sub-editors edited this article after it was first published. Right?
So this now brings me to my next point. Why lie? Why try to deceive ur readers into thinking u have never edited ur article when u kw u have? Why Fran, why? Do u have something to hide? I remember a saying from when I was young, how does it go again?
“Once a liar always a liar”
Thats it. Youre a liar Fran, thats what you are. You have lied about this and God kws best all the other things u lie about. Liar. You can take ur newspaper with you [which u have to beg people to donate towards otherwise you dont have enough funds to run] and sob in the bathroom now. You have been exposed and your guilty, unless of course you posess another magical sense.
Peace out!
Matthew
Mash’Allah well argued Matthew.
The Kuffaar are not ones to admit or own up to any faults they possess so don’t expect anything from her, instead, let’s spend our time THANKING Allah for guiding us upon the right and truthful path.
Fran, it’s ok, we all know Matthew just shut u up, just regain the little bit of dignity you have left, and leave it!
And I’d just like to add, that Matthew being part of City isoc would obviously defend the accusations of ‘extreme views’ etc made about the isoc, just as Fran is defending her article.
But labelling a whole society, made up of several individuals is ignorance at it’s best.
“Another restored but edited version was posted after this article was written.”
Matthew you are correct, perhaps my wording mislead. I added in the above sentence, approx 5 minutes after publishing after the story when it has had roughly 2 views, which I assumed were probably myself but it’s good to know we have such avid readers like yourself.
I thought that was a given from my wording? It’s called rolling news. When updates are put into stories. Editing is generally considered to be when the spelling or content already there is changed. I’m not going to get into an arguement over semantics.
But well done for spotting an obvious point the rest of the world spotted and understood three days ago. I thought we were still having a petty little argument about my spelling and changing my viewpoints, not the in’s and out’s of posting on Wordpress. I’d simply lost track of which heinous crime I was being accused of, but luckily I see now it was over sentencegate, not “burn the witch” crime of adding a fullstop or anything heretic like that. Phew. Glad it’s not over that. I don’t know how I’d live with myself. Subbing on a newspaper website. Whatever next?
I have offered to email you?
Thanks for clearing up the mystery surrounding the Isoc post though. Good to know they were asked to take it down because other people found it offensive. Says something don’t you think?
The threat is only for the afterlife? That’s alright then. Silly me. There I was thinking it’s not very nice to tell someone they are wrong to hold their beliefs and they are going to burn in eternal hellfire.
I haven’t told you that your views on homosexuals, Sikhs, women etc are wrong. I think they are pretty archaic, but you are allowed to have them. I am not going to resort to calling you disgusting and wishing a life of eating “pus and thorns”. I have approved every single one of you comments and let you have your say.
I also don’t think your views are representitive of all Muslims, or the Muslim students of the Islamic Society.
In response to – “But labelling a whole society, made up of several individuals is ignorance at it’s best.”
University Student, I am no way labelling every member of the society. In no way, and I sincerely hope no one thinks I have done that. When I refer to the society, I refer to the authors of the posts, and the societies organisers. I could be more specific, would the society answer my emails, maybe put a name to whose views are on the website. I’d love to meet the faceless “admin” who cannot be held accountable for anything apparently.
I am sure you didn’t mean to label the entire newspaper on my viewpoint? Just as I am sure, when Matthew wished ALL the reporters of the Inquirer to burn in hell was a slip of the tongue/thumb.
Does The Inquirer have some kind of hate campaign against Islam??? Almost half the stories on the home page are somewhat related to Islam or the ISoc. I’m sure there must be plenty more stuff going on in and around campus that you could be reporting on instead of running this campaign against Muslims and the ISoc. Actually, second thoughts, don’t report on anything because you are clearly amateurs in reporting as can be seen with the false and completely biased reports emanating from the paper. The ISoc is one of the biggest and most active societies on campus and with or without this tirade against it by the Inquirer it will always go strong. Your views are filthy, derogatory and inciting racial hatred. I’m surprised the student union or no university official has asked you to take down these posts which are based upon lies with the intention of bad naming Islam and Muslims on campus.
It is views like yours that boil up tempers and bring up controversy. Your sole intention is bad naming Islam, but Islam shall never be defeated. You fail to live up to reality, and are in denial of the truth. I am sure readers are not oblivious to the fact that you have a hate campaign going on, and I pray that within time the newspaper will be exposed, for the Islamophobic views that it has with the of stirring up racial hatred towards Muslims.
“The threat is only for the afterlife? That’s alright then. Silly me. There I was thinking it’s not very nice to tell someone they are wrong to hold their beliefs and they are going to burn in eternal hellfire.”
Observation: If an atheist takes offence to the above, does that not mean they have a feeling of regret or remorse for not believing in the afterlife?
I mean, if you do not actually believe in the afterlife, then why take offence? It is like a Christian saying to me if I do not believe Christ is the lord and not just a great prophet I will go to hell. It does not really bother me as I don’t believe in that. likewise, if an atheist said to meyour deluded for believing in a God and your missing out on alot in this life, it would not really bother me as I do not share his/her beliefs.
So really and truly, the punishment should only bother you if you feel something inside yourself. So if you do, act on it, and explore the wonderful deen of Al-Islam and if not, then don’t bother what people say regarding the punishment in the next life, because that is not in your beliefs to. (note: The punishment is real so I’d go with the former)
But please, to all non-muslims, do not moan about the punishment, if you fail to believe anyway. Kind of a contradiction one might say
I pray for Peace to those whom are upon true guidance and guidance to those who are not
(please don’t comment on my typos, this is my first and last post)
Matthew, you have no right to call Fran a liar. You have proved absolutely nothing with your messy little rants.
What are you trying to say exactly? We already understand that you’re an idiot. You don’t have to keep confirming it again and again with every post.
I am not scared of the threat of spending the afterlife in hellfire. You are correct I do not believe in hell. However, knowing the beliefs of Matthew, to condemn me to that, knowing he truly believes these horrible things will happen, to wish that on your worst enemy makes me think he is a very hateful man. This doesn’t worry me, but it should worry him. I simply find it offensive and rude.
To say all we report on is Islam is unfair, to say in a negative light is even more so. Have you read the newspaper? You will clearly see online and in past print edition, out of hundreds of stories, a handful of stories related to Islam. A handful of stories since 2006, does not an Islamphobe make. That is a lazy judgement. Some other stories include an article by Magda Ali in defence of Muslim students, reporting the rise of the BNP in our surrounding areas, reports of cancelled socialist meetings, an article on the Christian society inviting a homophobic preacher. We’ve even had a news story about Jedi’s. The story of the awful racially aggravated stabbings was run alongside the Abu Usamah invitation story. On the front page.
Can we not stray away from the point, Anwar al-Awlaki was placed in 2004 on a list of “specially designated global terrorists” by the US Treasury Department and the United Nations after he moved to Yemen. Then, whilst these links were emerging, the Isoc (I refer here to whoever the author is not the society in whole) then post an article apparently defending him. Now to me, this is not a tenuous link. To not report that, is incredibly bad journalism. To not report something where all the facts point in this direction, out of fear of the backlash and being branded with all the horrible names some of you have called me, would be bad journalism and cowardice.
As for inciting racial hatred? I don’t believe I have said anything against the religion of Islam, just reported on the individuals in this story, not on an entire belief system. I am shocked by that. You make like to look at the some of the comments made by one of the Isoc members here, about Sikh’s, and homosexuals, and atheists, and women etc before you lay down accusations of racial incitement. On both sides, there have been nasty comments about varying religions, and I don’t want any of it here.
I think if the University officals or Police were to take interest in this matter, it wouldn’t be me accused of stirring racial tensions. I will be closing this article for comments shortly so no more can be made as some have gone way too far. Some of the things said here have been incredibly acerbic, and had they not been made about me, but someone else would have been deleted already.
Being an independent newspaper we aren’t linked to the SU, so they or the University officials cannot ask us to remove things before you begin to criticise them. Being independent we are always looking for alternative viewpoints, if anyone has anything else they would like to say from here on in, please get in touch about writing a comment piece in the paper.
We will be having a new edition early February and welcome all responses. Likewise, if the Islamic Society officials or members have any stories, anything they feel they have been unfairly treated over, an announcement they would like to make to students, you can get in touch about that too.
“However, knowing the beliefs of Matthew, to condemn me to that, knowing he truly believes these horrible things will happen, to wish that on your worst enemy makes me think he is a very hateful man.”
does that mean you consider him to be an enemy vice versa?
yet agian this goes down to individual beliefs, you personally think that is the views of a very hateful man, then in your opinion all muslims are very hateful would’nt you think so as all muslim believe, non-muslims are going to hell
and its in all relgions, its not being hateful, disbelievers will go hellfire this is part of our core beliefs, and its God relgion so we cant change it anyway same way as we cant randomly accept homosexuality, and part of being a muslim requires us to believe in this…so regardless i think the point should be left at, your not a muslim so forget it and dont be offended. honeslty as a muslim i would not be offended if a jew or christians tells me that i will burn in hell because i dont believe in what they believe in… so dont take it to heart.
Regardless of your beliefs, these are the facts:
1) Fran Singh’s journalistic credibility was attacked by members of the iSoc.
2) No evidence was produced to support these attacks.
3) The conversation rapidly descended into absurdity, rudeness, racism and irrelevance.
Hellfire preaching is off topic and has no place in this discussion. Neither does racism against Sikhs, homophobia or bizarre analogies involving lions and burning kitchens.
Read the headline: “City Islamic Society defends radical preacher and threatens the Inquirer”
This has been well established as credible and therefore a very worrying development for city university. I expect the City Islamic Society to prepare an official response.
THIS ARTICLE IS NOW LOCKED AND CLOSED FOR COMMENT.
Please note for future reference regarding comment moderation – anonymous posting of an inflammatory nature will be deleted and if necessary reported. All posts made that go off the topic of the article will also be moved.
If you disagree with any content in the Inquirer, in print or online please get in touch and we will do our best to remedy the situation.
If you would like to write about any of the issues discussed here, or on any other topic, please let us know
Thunder Thiefs
The Times got the glory this month for the Inquirer's January splash revealing the cost, well in excess of £500,000, of removing former vice-chancellor Malcolm Gillies:
January - the Inquirer
April - Times Higher Education
Twitter
Recent Posts
Most Commented
most viewed